S3 E72: Coda: Reflections, Endings, and Beginnings
A very special episode to celebrate my 40th birthday, in which I am interviewed by my friend Lynn O’Brien about some exciting changes to my business and this podcast! We get reflective, and I share what’s in store for my new decade in my coaching and music work.
TOPICS DISCUSSED IN THIS EPISODE
What’s been going on lately in my work, and how the different elements balance
A new focus in my creative coaching work, what that will look like, and why
What I’m calling in as I enter my 40s
Tarot as an intuitive creative tool and how I use it
Leaning into being “spiritually curious”
Checking in with my word of the year (VISIONARY) and what it means
Trusting the growth and processing that happens under the surface
How I’m seeking out community and support
What’s coming up in my musician life (a new album!)
How I might share my process of making this new album
Normalizing struggle as a part of the creative process and embracing process over product
Pondering a Kickstarter, why I think it will be easier this time
What I’ve learned from doing this podcast and how it might re-emerge in the future
Tending to the garden of your work ecosystem
What I’m excited about, big and small
MORE FROM REBECCA
Creative Wellness Letters (my every-other-week notes of encouragement for your creative life)
Compassionate Creativity Coworking Club (try your first session for free!)
Sign up for the free Feel Good Creativity Unchallenge (5 days of super easy creativity + wellness prompts)
My PDF workbook: Fuel Your Creative Work With Compassionate Productivity
RELATED RESOURCES
Giant Steps Creative entrepreneurs conference
E62: My Favorite Oracle and Tarot Decks for Connecting Creativity and Self Care
Sacred Creators Oracle Deck (aff. link)
Troublepaws video (my Brazilian choro about Tsuki the cat)
Laser Webber the amazing Kickstarter consultant
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Rebecca Hass :
Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of Being a Whole Person. It's been a while, and I have to admit I'm feeling a little bit rusty in the podcast saddle today, but I am happy to be here with you. This is a very special episode, not in the 1990s sitcom "very special episode" tragedy kind of way, but a special episode, because for one thing, it's going to be the last episode of the podcast.
Rebecca Hass :
You've probably been wondering, "Oh, you've been on break for a long time, and what's up with that?" I will explain more about what's behind that, and I will also say, maybe just the last episode in this format. I hope to return in a different way in the not-too-distant future. This episode is also coming out on my fortieth birthday, May 12, 2023, and that feels momentous for lots of reasons. I'm excited about a new decade, which we'll also talk about in the show.
Rebecca Hass :
I just said "we", because this podcast is an interview, and my dear friend Lynn O'Brien is going to be interviewing me today. Lynn is a singer-songwriter, a coach, and all-around wonderful human, and I highly encourage you to check out her Welcome Home embodied coaching sessions, and her music, it is all so wonderful. Lynnobrien.love is her website, and you can find that in the show notes. So I'm going to turn it over to Lynn to be the host. Hi Lynn!
Lynn O'Brien :
Hi, Rebecca.
Rebecca Hass :
I'm so glad you're here.
Lynn O'Brien :
Thanks for having me. This is fun to sit in the host seat for a change.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, I'm excited to not be in the host seat for a change.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, well, settle in and relax. Hi, everybody. Yes, I'm a friend of Rebecca Hass. I think we met at a Giant Steps Creative Entrepreneurs and Entrepreneurial Creatives conference in Minneapolis years back.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, several years ago.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, yeah, and I'm a big fan. So I'm really curious just to jump in here and give us a lay of the land of what's been going on for you since you took this podcast break.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, well, things have been weird for us, collectively, over the last few years. The pandemic changed a lot of things about my work. People who have listened to the podcast for a while know that I moved to California from Minnesota in 2019, and then, nine months later, the world stopped. And that was a weird thing for being a musician, of course, and, you know, everybody switched their work online. A lot of things weren't happening, so in terms of my musician life, I feel like I didn't really have as much going on until this past fall of 2022.
Rebecca Hass :
I've always really liked balancing a lot of different things in my life. And of course that can sometimes be too much and balancing coaching and music is not always the same balance.Throughout this school year, my work has been heavier on the music side for the first time in a while. So that is really exciting, and it also became kind of overwhelming because you start to see, "Okay, I like having these secure things on the calendar for income reasons," but then you start to think, "I don't like having so many things on the calendar, for flexibility reasons." And you know, I'm happy with my decision to make this a busier music school year and I want to change that upcoming.
Rebecca Hass :
So because my life was full with these other things, I felt like I had to take a break from the podcast because you cannot do everything. You know I'm all about leaving time for rest and not forcing yourself into burnout, and unfortunately that sometimes means stopping doing things that you want to do. Those decisions can be really hard. And I thought, OK I'm definitely taking a break in December because that's a busy month and I often do that.
Rebecca Hass :
As winter progressed, I thought that I would be less busy and I wasn't. So I thought, "All right, I'll come back in the spring." Of course, spring's really busy too, and the more I think about it, the more I just feel like I cannot sustainably keep producing episodes of the podcast on a regular basis. And if I'm going to be doing a podcast, I do want it to have some kind of consistency. So I decided that this will be the last episode in this format.
Rebecca Hass :
I say, "in this format," because there are also going to be some changes to my coaching business coming up, and I've decided that I really want to focus on working with musicians more. If you are listening to this and you're like, "Oh no, I'm not a musician and I really want to work with you," still reach out to me. I'm not saying the door is closed to everyone but musicians, but I'm going to kind of start focusing around that. I also want to work in elements of spiritual practice more into the way that I work with coaching clients, which is interesting because I'm not sure exactly what that will look like yet.
Rebecca Hass :
I felt a little nervous about talking about that today, because I was like, "No, I need this to be fully formed and fully figured out before I talk about it." But I like when people give that sort of peek behind the curtain and they kind of share their process. So that's what I'm doing here today.
Lynn O'Brien :
Beautiful, beautiful. Yeah, I see you walking your talk in terms of letting yourself pause on things that you'd like to do, but there just isn't space for. I certainly relate, and I see so many creators out there really recalibrating during this post-pandemic time, of like, "Yeah, who am I now? What's the rhythm like? How full do I want life to be? All these things are possible again, but I feel different," and, you know, "what fits and what doesn't?" So very exciting to hear about the ways your work is shifting. I'd love to hear a little bit more about working with musicians and why that's feeling like a match, as well as integrating some of these spiritual pieces, that sounds super cool.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, I wonder if I can explain it tangibly enough for other ears to understand, or if I understand it enough to word it quite yet but, yeah, working, more with musicians feels like a way for me to integrate my own identity better. And I think for some reason in the past I was resistant to the idea of focusing in with just working with musicians and I'm not sure why that is. I'm still kind of trying to unpack it. I think it might have been tied up with the fact that when I was mainly a piano teacher, and had 30 plus students and was super burned out, I was just like, "I can't do this musician hustle thing," and I didn't want to give in to the pressure of that. Maybe that's a part of it.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, having that depth of experience that you have, gives you so many insights into what it's like to be a working artist.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, and I think also I'm really thinking more about relationships, not just in music, but in every aspect of my life. If I'm thinking of what I want the theme of this new decade to be. I think that is one of the main ones. I know as a person who has been an overworker, I have often put work ahead of relationships, ahead of friendships, and that takes its toll, right, when you just don't have a lot of energy left over for those things. So it's not that I have no friends or no relationships that are good in my life, but I think I need to be more intentional about making space for that stuff in my life. And also just I really want to call in more delicious musical collaborations, and have that sort of connection in my musical collaborations. There's always a wide variety of things, right? When you're a working musician, you might be on a gig with people who you like, but you're not going to hang out with outside of the gig. You might be best friends with them. You might be on a gig with someone you don't get along with. Like there's this whole range and when you're really busy with lots of different types of things, it's harder to say, "Okay. I really want to call in more of the deeper relationships," when the time is already full with who knows what, you know. And I'm not saying that in a backhanded way to be like, I don't like who I'm working with right now, just to be clear. But I just, I want to go deeper.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, I get that. And it sounds like at this turning point of looking ahead to this new decade, that there really is an opportunity to pause and set some intentions and really reflect. And before you launch into the next busy season, really thinking about like, "Yeah, I want depth of relationship, I want friendships, I want meaningful collaborations. I want more specificity in my work working with musicians. I want to explore what it would mean to integrate more spiritual practice, even if I don't exactly know what that means."
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, it's interesting because a lot of astrology and tarot and these kinds of practices have become really popular in the last several years. And I've really embraced those things as creative tools too, especially like tarot decks and oracle decks. And then when I think about, "Okay, I want to create a tarot spread, that would be a really fun thing to do related to creativity, and that is something that I want to do," then I hear part of my brain going, "Ooh, you're not a tarot reader. You don't even know what all the cards mean. You shouldn't do that." And it's like, is that true? I don't think so. I think what I'm really leaning into is being spiritually curious. And I think that that's the kind of spirit that will also be in the people that end up being attracted to my work. It doesn't have to be any rigid identity, it doesn't have to be like, the witchiest rituals, or whatever it is. It's just, "I'm curious about this," and again, depth, right? Depth and presence are what we're leaning towards and it's so important to tune into your intuition and trust in order to engage in the creative process, and I feel like any opportunity you have to turn inward and be able to hear yourself and your inner voice better is going to open up all of that.
Lynn O'Brien :
Totally, yeah. And I think a lot of people would identify that as a spiritual practice, you know, whether or not that's their language. But I really like this concept of spiritually curious. And kind of inviting clients into like, let's explore together. Let's see what works for you. Does this tarot deck interest you? Let's just use different tools to help you kind of get inside and get clear.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, and curiosity is one of our best tools for creativity, absolutely. Anywhere, we can follow what seems cool, what has a little spark, that's where the magic is going to be.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, totally. Is there any certain spiritual practice that you know, you mentioned tarot decks, is there any one that you recommend, or a certain way that you use it that's been personally useful or interesting lately for you?
Rebecca Hass :
I wouldn't say I recommend any certain one necessarily. I think whatever resonates with you, if you're like, "This art is really pretty," and you know, if it's something you want to work with, that's it. Great, go for it. I will say that one of my favorites, ever since I got it a couple years ago, is the Sacred Creators Oracle from Chris-Anne. I think Pixie Curio is her name on Instagram, or it was in the past. But if you find Chris-Anne, I'll put that in the show notes for everybody if you want to look it up. I really like this deck because it's geared toward creative people and it seems like whenever I pull a card from it, it's like what I need to hear. I feel like I have a connection with it more than some other ones, and it's got a little book with it that's like, here's the description of what this card means, and here's some prompts for how you can use this in your creative life.
Lynn O'Brien :
Oh, very cool. Yeah, that sounds great.
Rebecca Hass :
And the card I pulled today, it was about casting off doubt. And it said, "embrace your own brilliance and shine like the freaking sun" in the description. And I was like, yeah, that is the spirit for today's podcast. I love this. Thank you very much.
Lynn O'Brien :
That's so good. Shine like the freaking sun.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, yeah. And to elaborate a little more on how I use these things, sometimes I just, I'm like, I want to pull a card for, what's the spirit of today going to be? Or like, what energy would be supportive for me today. Sometimes I'll do it before I sit down to compose, and that's the energy of this particular session of being creative. I also like to do, I find other people's tarot spreads for the new and full moon, or you know, events like astrological events, and I'll just kind of do something more extensive for that and I'll journal on each one and just kind of see what comes up. So I don't use it as a predictive tool. I use it as a tool to get to know my inner thoughts on something and, hopefully, to uncover some inner wisdom in places where I don't have it quite yet.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, and it sounds like it's also a tool for presence. You know, what do I need in this session or these next few hours, or today, where I think some folks, myself included, sometimes can use these tools predictively or as a big picture, you know, like a Magic 8 ball, kind of like, give me the answer, and I personally find a lot of value and inspiration in this. Smaller chunks, smaller questions, using it more as a presence practice, and I hear some of that in what you're describing.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, that feels very resonant. And then also as you said that I thought, I remembered that the way that I choose cards also kind of has that presence. I often will just take the whole deck and spread it out in a line on like my dresser and then I'll just stare at it, to see which card is like, pick me, I want this one and something about that, tuning in to even pick the card is a really powerful way of getting more presence, too.
Lynn O'Brien :
Love that. Yes, absolutely.
Rebecca Hass :
And just taking the time to listen. When I have a really busy day and I can take 10 minutes to do that in the morning, I feel so much better, even if I "don't have time." I'm using air quotes here. You know, it's really not that hard to take 10 minutes to do it, and it's definitely worth doing that. Or just like some meditation, or breathing, or something like that.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, like a mindfulness moment to start your day.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, exactly.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, that's great. And it sounds like this theme of mindfulness and reflectiveness is something that you're wanting to carry into this upcoming chapter. I'm reminded of your word of the year, and I'm curious if you want to reflect it at all, on what that's been like so far. I know this will come out on your birthday. Here we are in May already. Do you want to check in on your word of the year?
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, my word of the year is "visionary." If you want to hear more about that and why I picked it can go back to the previous episode that I released at the new year, reflecting on last year's word and explaining what I want from this year's word. And some words of the year don't really make it. Sometimes I pick it and it just fizzles out, and doesn't feel like the right word anymore. But "visionary" feels so right still, in May, and I'm guessing it will continue to. It just feels like at this point in my life, this age, which is arbitrary but just kind of where I'm at right now, it's just like a craving for no bullshit. I just want to do less of the stuff that doesn't matter, and more of the stuff that does, because none of us know how much time we have left. I'm healthy as far as I know. I have no reason to believe that I will have a short life. But you just never know, right? So I want to make it matter.
Lynn O'Brien :
Hallelujah. Louder for the people in the back! Yes. You never know. That's so cool that it's still resonating and it also feels tied to the ways you're digging into the foundation of your business and like, what do I stand for and what do I really want? And yeah, you know, i'm kind of driving the car here. Which direction do I want to go in next?
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, and it's so easy to fall into the shoulds of what you think other people think you should be doing. I spent most of my life doing that until, I don't know, sometime in my twenties when I had another one of those reckoning moments and you're like, "What? I don't have to follow someone else's path, and I can,slash, I have to find my own path," which is both exhilarating and terrifying, obviously. But yeah, it just feels like the word "visionary" is a great litmus test, also, like, what would a visionary do right now? And sometimes the answer to that is not something huge. Like you hear "visionary" and you think, the CEO of this like amazing company who has this great vision for the future and for creating change in the world and all these things, and like, that's great, but visionary could also mean, I need to spend all day on the couch today because I'm too tired to have a vision. I need to rest in order to get in touch with my vision again, and make it clear. I also just found out that I need reading glasses, so that's like a funny little meaning to visionary.
Lynn O'Brien :
Ok, universe, you're listening.
Rebecca Hass :
I got it! Going to the optometrist.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, sometimes those things really do line up though, and I love what you're saying. And I see this theme in so much of your content, too, about being a visionary isn't this external huge action as defined by capitalist culture and achievement culture. It's also having the wisdom to rest, and to let things incubate and to move slower, to take little bite sizes or to join a coworking club, or to get accountability, or get a coach. And being brave enough to take those small steps in service of your vision, or to just catch a whiff of your vision as it passes through on the breeze that day, yeah and I just, I feel like the way you're kind of redefining that is so needed.
Rebecca Hass :
Thanks yeah, it's also trusting the way that I am, and being true to myself. And I'm a Taurus, as you know, because I told you that my birthday is May twelfth, but like there are a lot of other Tauruses in my chart, and I really identify with that sort of slow moving, needs a lot of rest, maybe digs in their heels too much, maybe is "too slow" sometimes. But I really do resonate with that, lining up with my personality. And when you think about the stereotypes of entrepreneurship and all these kinds of things, people are like, "fail fast, fail big, do the thing, make the big decisions." I am really not the person who's just going to make a quick decision most of the time. I need time to simmer with it. I need to digest it, until it turns into something that's usable. So that's part of it too, is embracing that even though it looks like nothing is happening on the outside, that there's just so much growth and so much processing going on under the surface. I feel like this reflective mood started, I mean, I've always been a reflective person, but I feel like I really got reflective at the turn of the year, the beginning of 2023, just thinking, oh, you know, "My thirties are ending. What do I want? What do I need?" All of that. And I've been going through just deep to the foundations of, what am I doing as a coach? How exactly do I help people? Is there, I know I have a method, but I've never actually written it down. So I'm like going through the process of fully making that something that is tangible to me. And you know that'll be great because it'll be easier to describe to others. And you know, have people understand why it might be helpful for them. So, going to the foundations is slow and sometimes really tedious work, but it's feeling very nourishing.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, it feels so true, so authentic to who you are and also in line with this, no BS, when you're really willing to get aligned with yourself and who you naturally are and what you naturally want and really live and work as that. That's the foundation, that's enough. And that's the premise, and that's what will work and what I want to pay attention to. I think that's so powerful and will be really foundational for the future of your work and your forties. I'm excited for you.
Rebecca Hass :
Thank you. Me too.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah and what kind of, you know, I know in your work you also talk about, you know, not going it alone and having community or having support. As you do this foundational work, what are some of the ways that there's support in your life or that you're going to be calling in support in your business and in your personal life?
Rebecca Hass :
That's a great question, and one that I was just talking about it therapy this week. You're right on. I am a Midwestern person who learned by example that you're not supposed to ask for help, that you're supposed to like, grit your teeth and just figure it out. Not to say I had no support of any kind in my family, I obviously did. But like that's sort of the underlying tone of things, is that it's better to not ask for help and bother other people and all this kind of stuff. So that is still a deep ingrained thing that I know that I need to work on and I think that is a great theme for this decade too.
Rebecca Hass :
I want to say very specifically I am calling in not some kind of terrible illness that forces me into support. I had a friend who said, "I want to focus on my health this year," as an intention and like she got a cancer diagnosis that year. So I feel superstitious about saying embracing support, not calling in anything big and terrible. That's just my anxious brain, needed to say that out loud for some reason. But the ways that I have support I think are through mostly just one on one deeper friendship connections from various points in my life - my sister, my parents, my partner Tom, obviously. I don't know why I didn't say him first, because he lives here and he is always with me. Or, you know, most of the time.
Rebecca Hass :
I also have this wonderful online circle of women and nonbinary folks that has been just this wonderful experience of seeing other people model asking for support. People will make a post and say, "This is the type of feedback that I want." And at first I was like, "You can do that? Like, you can ask for specific types of feedback and it's like, yeah, consent is important, and we get to ask for what we need, and we get to be really specific about that too. So that community is just really wonderful for being witnessed in difficult things and wonderful things and everything in between.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, and learning how to advocate for yourself, and ask specifically for what you need.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, and learning how to receive it is huge, because I still have some discomfort with that. That's a practice. I have to name my pets, also, and pet, singular as in the living one, Tsuki the cat, who is my - one of my friends said "Minister of Mischief" was a good title for him.
Lynn O'Brien :
I love that.
Rebecca Hass :
But he teaches me about play and curiosity, and I always say that his motto is "I just go for it!" He doesn't really think about the consequences.
Lynn O'Brien :
For those of you who can't see visually, sitting behind Rebecca in a really lovely patch of light is said Minister of Mischief getting his nap on in a box, and, wish we could all be doing that.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, so he is half hilarious, playful, and then he's also a cat, so he is sleeping most of the time. So my dearly departed cat, Rusty was my relaxation mentor and I think Tsuki is like maybe half relaxation mentor, but also all of this other wonderful playful energy too. He inspired a composition to be written about him, called Troublepaws, because he gets into stuff. Yeah, I'll put a link to a recording of that in the show notes, because it's very fun.
Lynn O'Brien :
I don't think I've heard that one.
Rebecca Hass :
Oh, OK, I'll share it with you after this.
Lynn O'Brien :
Awesome. Yeah. And speaking of that, what is your musical and composition life like? Any vision for how that might unfold in your forties? Any projects you want to mention?
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, well, I have no idea how it's going to unfold in my forties, except for maybe some near future plans. I have never been a huge future planner into the longer ranges. I'm such a planner when it comes to short term things, and I think that's kind of a high-functioning anxiety symptom that happens to serve me well in organizing my life most of the time.
Rebecca Hass :
So I don't know about the whole decade, and I like to just kind of follow where things take me. I've decided that I'm not really focusing on composing for any specific, or trying to get any specific kind of opportunities. At the moment I'm welcoming things, and like, if I got a commission, that would be awesome, but that's not the main way. I've decided that I don't want to rely on composition for income, and I want it to just be whatever it is. If I make income from it, that's awesome, but I need it to be what it needs to be for me first. So that's sort of the undertone. And funny you should ask, I have decided after five years since my first album, that I need to record a solo piano album made up of things that I wrote in my thirties because I have a huge backlog of things.
Lynn O'Brien :
Oh, that's a cool concept.
Rebecca Hass :
And it will be, I'm announcing it on my fortieth birthday. I was like, I could release it on my fortieth birthday, and then as I started going through my notebook, I was like, this is going to take quite a bit longer, and will probably involve some crowdfunding and things like that. So I guess this is the, if you want to make a birth metaphor, this is the pregnancy announcement for the album and very early. I don't know when it will be birthed quite yet, but, I have gone through most of my composition notebooks and kind of cataloged things to see, okay, this is a candidate, this isn't. And I've decided everything that I wrote at least a big chunk of during my thirties is eligible for the album. Like, if it's not quite finished, I can still finish it and it can still be a part of that.
Rebecca Hass :
I did a 100-day project, 2 100-day projects actually, in 2017 where I wrote 8 measures every day. And longtime listeners have probably heard me talk about that a lot, but that had lots of ideas that I totally forgot about, many of which I'm like, "Oh, that's pretty cool, actually." So I don't know if there will be many things that I want to finish, or if I'll just be like, this is just a bunch of miniatures or what, lots of different styles. I don't know what the theme is in any way besides "stuff I wrote in my thirties," but I'm still kind of trying to put that together. Maybe there'll be different sections of it that are like, this is the more jazz section, or this is cinematic, or whatever, If I start to notice themes. It'll be like making a mixtape!
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah wow. Well, congratulations on your, you know, "album pregnancy".
Rebecca Hass :
Thank you!
Lynn O'Brien :
I'm very intrigued by this idea of archiving A decade at a time. You know, now that we're at an age where you can do that.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, right.
Lynn O'Brien :
Old enough to have decades behind you that you're tracking and growing through and remembering, and you know, sometimes the only time I really look back to archive is at the end of the year, like for a New Year's or a solstice kind of practice. And so this idea of really thinking about the last 10 years as a span and really considering the body of work that you made in those years is really, yeah, just a really rich one to explore for me.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, well, and you have more decades of songwriting, and writing than I do. How old were you when you started writing music?
Lynn O'Brien :
You know, I grew up really playing by ear and I was always making things up. I think I started writing like full compositions when I was 9.
Rebecca Hass :
Awesome.
Lynn O'Brien :
And a lot of the songs that came out in those younger years were very soap opera, dramatic. I was like a little Enneagram 2, little empath. And what would come out was like, what would it be like to be married to an alcoholic, but then go home to an abusive family and to be deaf. And then I'd like, write, I mean it was these immature but empathetic stories of folks who I perceived were struggling. And then writing their stories, and writing songs for folks in my life and giving them out and. it's so funny because I had a pretty solid childhood growing up in the country with a pretty harmonious family, but the compositions that were coming out freaked everybody out.
Rebecca Hass :
"Is she OK?"
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, and I've released some of those songs just for fun and to make my audiences laugh over the years but...
Rebecca Hass :
I remember that, one of your teenage angsty songs at a show. And I was like, this is so delightful that you're willing to share the deep cuts in the catalog.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, so much angst, and that, you know, I love that. I love when there's an artist I really fall in love with. And when it's available, there's just so much data out there on the Internet that we can really see, like Rachel Price on Lake Street Dive. I can see what it was like when she performed as a young teenager. I can get to know and watch her development as a vocalist over the years, or other folks in composition and now we have this record of your last album as well. It's just really special to watch the evolution. And I think it gives so much permission to other people creating, especially for those of us who, after I release an album, it's kind of irrelevant to me after a few years, it feels like, "Oh that was a diary entry. And who resonates with their diary a few years later?" And yet it's such an honest snapshot of where we are and where we've been, you know, it's the most honest thing we have. So I'm excited to see kind of what your thirties sounded like in this way.
Rebecca Hass :
Thanks, yeah. 2017 when I wrote all of that stuff, I mean, I wrote stuff through, I would say, let's see, how old was I when I said I was a composer? Like, out loud. I think I was 33. And I had written things before that, but I hadn't written much before that because it was sort of that secret, " I don't know, can I really do this?" And so it's really like 2/3 of the decade that were really being a composer. But that's interesting that you say it feels like a diary entry and you want to have the album kind of behind you. I feel half that way about my last album and half not. There are a few of the songs on there that I'm like, I'm kind of tired of this one, whatever. But some of them really still feel really good. I think it's different with instrumental music that doesn't have as much narrative or, you know, when you have lyrics, there's just a different way of approaching things, and I think, a different way of being really personal with it that I could see feels more like a diary entry.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, yeah. And I'm sure it's different for each artist and what composing is for them. But that's great that some of it's still feeling so fresh and interesting too.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, thanks! Yeah, I'm big on sharing my process, so I'm hoping to maybe share more about what it was like to decide what to put on it, or maybe just kind of explaining, sometimes I used composition prompts to decide what to write that day, or just kind of sharing more about the process. I also made like a mini secret podcast as an experiment last summer for a membership program that I decided to not go ahead with. And I think I will put that out in some way. I just basically did a dispatch each week that was like, "Here's what I did with composing this week," and some weeks it was like, "This week was not so good. I didn't do very much and here's why, and here's how I approached it." Or like, "Here's what feelings were coming up and here's how I went ahead, even though some of those voices were pretty loud, telling me not to do it today.
Lynn O'Brien :
That's cool, yeah. What a cool way for people to learn from your process and maybe start tracking their own in their own way.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah. I wish that I had more examples like that when I was starting to do this, and that might be a function of me having wanted a path to follow, and not wanting to necessarily forge out totally on my own, but I think it's just really validating to see other people doing these things, and to see other people struggling, and normalizing that there is struggle. There's a whole process before we get this finished product. It's a whole iceberg underneath, you know, and that's real and it's normal and we all go through it.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes. You know, more and more, I learn, gosh, the process really is the most important part. That's where we spend most of our time. Most of our life is spent in the process working towards product. And a friend of mine who had once said, I actually can't remember the specific goal he was going for, but he said, "How can I do this process in a way that I don't resent it, or I'm not exhausted by it by the time I get to the product? How can I be in joy and in presence in this process and how can that be the real value?" And then the product happens or doesn't happen. And you know, it's such a simple concept, but it also feels so radical in our culture.
Rebecca Hass :
It really does.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, like and including this, "O h, how can I? How can I enjoy the process of turning 40, or of being in this upcoming decade, or of letting this new album come to pass? How can I set this experience up in a way which is going to be a lot of work with a lot of intention and care and support?" Yeah, just really investing there is so rich.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, thanks for bringing that up, because as I ponder whether I should do a Kickstarter again, part of me is like, "Oh, this will be fun." And part of me is like, "Oh my God, that's going to be a lot of work. When can I possibly do this?" Yes, I think it'll be simpler this time, because I have done it before and I have a good template from our friend Laser, who we both used as a wonderful consultant for Kickstarter. I don't know, I couldn't have done it without him.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, yeah, Laser is amazing. I want to say that the website is Laser Campaigns. I can check real quick.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, I think you're right. It'll be in the show notes for everybody.
Lynn O'Brien :
Okay, perfect. Yes, if anyone's looking for a real guide and companion, and just a powerhouse of knowledge, Laser is amazing for crowdfunding. All things crowdfunding.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, and we both hired him as a consultant, as a one-on-one thing, but he also has free classes, and wrote a book about crowdfunding. There's stuff for you even if you're not ready to commit at that level. So I always sing Laser's praises when crowdfunding comes up.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, absolutely. And it was such a"teach somebody to fish" situation. Like when I started talking to him and getting tips, yeah, it was well before I was ready, but it's stuff that I will carry into the rest of my career, whether it's crowdfunding, or just remembering to ask for support or remembering how we see people's launch of these things and we forget all that goes into behind the scenes to prepare and to prepare your community to give and all that.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, right.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, what a big practice. But that's cool. And yes, having done it once it definitely makes me feel more like it's more possible, and I have a sense of the scope of the work and how not to overdo it as I did a wee bit with this last one.
Rebecca Hass :
Which was spectacular. You got funded in one day!
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes, it was. It was an incredible experience. It really was. I think we ended up going over twice what I was asking for.
Rebecca Hass :
Wow.
Lynn O'Brien :
But yeah it's quite a journey.
Rebecca Hass :
It is. I'm hoping it'll be a little bit easier this time. Also, because I'm doing a solo album, part of the logistical part of it is like when can the musicians come, and paying people to record, like, these were my friends on my album. But I was like, no, I'm not paying you a friend rate, like, we're going to raise the amount that you deserve to make for this. So I think my goal will get to be lower this time because I'm just doing it on my own.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, that makes sense.
Rebecca Hass :
And then just like booking studio time with just one person's availability is also so much easier.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. I'm excited. There's one other question coming to mind. I'm just aware that, for now, in its current form, this is your last episode of this podcast, and excited to see how or when it transforms into something else in the future. But you know, you've been doing this for a while, and you've really experimented with so many different topics, and gotten all kinds of feedback, and I'm just curious if you want to say anything about what you've learned, or what gift this podcast experience has given you so far as you as it comes to a close for now.
Rebecca Hass :
Thanks for that excellent question. Well, in case listeners have not heard the beginning of this podcast, it was actually a totally different show for the first two seasons. My friend Lexie and I had this podcast as an interview style show where we explored the relationship or like the intersection, I guess, of business, spirituality, and creativity. So that was really fun to get to talk to lots of people from different backgrounds and just have deep conversations, deep, honest conversations. That's really the only kind of conversation that I want to have, and that's just the most rich and the most real. And that was really great. And then Lexie had other interests that she wanted to make time for. So she said, "I want to leave the show, but I think that you should keep doing it. This name of the show, Being A Whole P erson, is perfect for your work, like please go on, and go forth and take it where you will. And so I decided, okay, this is about the intersection of creativity and wellness now because that's what my coaching work is all about. And it's been really fun to both interview people, and to just get to share thoughts that can help people in a small tangible container. Because I think in this busy, I was going to say "this busy time." When is it not a busy time in the era that we are living in, bombarded with information, small bites are good, but also meandering conversations are good. So I really enjoyed getting to know lots of people, asking people who I was like, "I wonder if this person would want to do it." And I only kind of knew them on the Internet. And then we got to talk in real life. That is just so fun to get to have a real connection with people beyond just, you know, typing and Instagram and all that kind of stuff. So then getting to do that in a way that can share our experiences with other people in a way that can be helpful, like, that's just awesome. So I really enjoyed all of that. Also, at one point in my life, I was horrified by the idea of listening to myself talk, and, editing my own podcast, I'm totally over it, completely desensitized, and I feel like I'm more comfortable with speaking. I have done public speaking and like pursue that as a thing and if you had asked me of 10 years ago if I wanted to do that, I would have like ran and hid somewhere, so.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, what a great opportunity to practice.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, exactly. In a way that makes you just a little bit nervous, but yet you're still in the safety of your own home.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yes. Yeah, and it's one thing to be a good conversationalist or to be able to be present, and it's another to be with somebody, but also keeping that, you know, that invisible wall in that audience, in that third party, that can be really diverse, in mind.
Rebecca Hass :
Right. So I've learned that I still like podcasting, and it's really just that fitting it in is challenging right now. I have an idea for a new season that I was going to try and launch now, but I thought, "Okay, your May is so crazy, like, what are you doing? That's not a good idea." So I'm not sure when it will happen. I don't want to make any promises because I just don't really know where it's going to fit, but I have a seed of an idea. Here's a teaser, of a season that is centered around embodiment. And I have a few friends and people in mind that would be amazing to talk to about embodiment and creativity. So I think that's what's going to happen. I don't know if it's going to be under the same name, if it needs a new name. I'm not sure what it wants to be. Like any creative project, you can try to make it into something, but if you try to listen to what it wants to be, that's how it's really going to take shape. So I haven't really had time to like feel out the whole identity of what it should be, but that's what I'm thinking so far.
Lynn O'Brien :
I love it. I love it, yeah. The listening in process has begun with that, I hear.
Rebecca Hass :
Definitely. And I'm not into rushing it, like we talked about, it will unfold as it is supposed to.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah. And it sounds kind of like, you know, you're tending to a garden of your work, and some things have certain seasons where they bloom and others are like, okay, that just grows every year, don't have to do much there. Some things need a lot more intensive labor, and you're really watching that balance and, you know, continuing on fully with your work podcasting.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, that's something that I learned from how I was doing the podcast. Also with Lexie, we did seasons, and our first season, we didn't know what we were doing. We didn't know how to do it. We were figuring everything else out. Like it was cool to just see, okay, I can learn this new skill and figure out how to do this. And we had each, I think, several people we wanted to reach out to. And we did, and they pretty much all said yes. Then, accidentally, we scheduled them all for interviews in the span of like 2 weeks. So that was like all I did for two weeks and we were like, "All right, we're not doing that again.
Lynn O'Brien :
I remember that. Yeah, and this is how we learn.
Rebecca Hass :
Were you on season one or season 2? I don't remember, I think you were on season 2.
Lynn O'Brien :
I think I was on season 2, but I remember you having all these back-to-back things and it being like a deep dive. Yeah, that is some full time podcast hosting.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, we went all in. It was great. But it was also not a sustainable schedule. And what I learned really from doing it on my own, as I was aiming to do a weekly episode because I think I felt pressure to be like, all right, you got to pump out that content, and you know, keep the weekly schedule going and that wasn't sustainable for me, so I switched it to every other week. And I really think that in the future it's going to need to be a more limited, seasonal kind of thing, which is how lots of people do podcasts. And that's great. And you know, people stay subscribed to the feed. It'll come up when it comes up. I personally, even with podcasts I love sometimes don't remember when they're going to come out, and then all of a sudden it's like, "Oh, it's back in my feed. This is delightful." So yeah, don't unsubscribe. Look forward to a delightful surprise sometime in the future. Also, if you are subscribed to my newsletter, I will put it out there and give more announcements as things unfold.
Lynn O'Brien :
Right on, yeah. Well, I've really enjoyed what I've heard of your podcast and it's exciting to be part of it in this way today. Thank you so much for sharing and for this delightful conversation. I've got one more question for you as we send you into your forties, and send this podcast into some rest: What are you excited about?
Rebecca Hass :
I'm going to give you the deep answer and the just fun answer. Well, we already talked about the deep answer. I'm excited about making the album. I'm excited about what's to come with calling in new things in my work and new relationships and deepening existing relationships and all of those things. But today I am excited about - today as in the day it comes out, is not only my birthday, but the day that the new Zelda game comes out for Nintendo Switch, and I have preordered, it will be arriving on my doorstep. I preordered it also using entirely gift cards and points, so I bought myself a free birthday gift.
Lynn O'Brien :
Living the dream.
Rebecca Hass :
Could not be better. I really love Zelda Breath of the Wild. And this is the sequel to it, and I've been getting really pumped about it. So I think in this busy season that just like playing a video game for most of the day, on my birthday I have to work in the morning, but I have the afternoon and evening. I think that's how I'm going to do it.
Lynn O'Brien :
Oh yeah. Oh, yes, yes. May Zelda be with you.
Rebecca Hass :
Thank you! Yeah, May the Elf be with you.
Lynn O'Brien :
That sounds super fun, and yes to havingbig vision and small delights to look forward to.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, we need all of it.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, love it, cool. Well, thanks for letting me try my hand at hosting, and thank you for chatting with me and helping us all get a sense of where you've been, what's ending, what's beginning, and what you're listening in for, what's to come.
Rebecca Hass :
Thank you and thank you for talking with me. I'm so delighted that you wanted to do this with me.
Lynn O'Brien :
Yeah, my pleasure. It's been great to chat with you.
Rebecca Hass :
Yeah, thanks for listening everyone. I will catch you in the next iteration!
Pianist and composer